Quest: Wandertag #5446

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AliasAlreadyTaken · 2023-11-02T02:04:58Z

AliasAlreadyTaken commented

2023-11-02 02:04:58 +00:00

Please discuss here your opinion towards this quest.

Setup: Adventurers can place a certain structure in their exclusively owned private area. Nothing complex, but a recognizable structure. When they finish the structure with a certain block, the structure and location is entered into a list.

Loop: Once a day (rollover midnight utc) one of the locations of the list is chosen to be today's target. Everyone who wants to take this quest talks to an NPC who reveals the owner and location of today's target. Maybe people also get a compass. When an adventurer reaches the location of today's target and touches it, they get a small reward and it is recorded how many locations they already visited. This value is visible via /info PLAYERNAME

Purpose: This way private area owners can advertise their private area and signal they are open for visitors.

Please discuss here your opinion towards this quest. Setup: Adventurers can place a certain structure in their exclusively owned private area. Nothing complex, but a recognizable structure. When they finish the structure with a certain block, the structure and location is entered into a list. Loop: Once a day (rollover midnight utc) one of the locations of the list is chosen to be today's target. Everyone who wants to take this quest talks to an NPC who reveals the owner and location of today's target. Maybe people also get a compass. When an adventurer reaches the location of today's target and touches it, they get a small reward and it is recorded how many locations they already visited. This value is visible via /info PLAYERNAME Purpose: This way private area owners can advertise their private area and signal they are open for visitors.

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AliasAlreadyTaken added the

1. kind/protocol

label 2023-11-02 02:05:06 +00:00

daydream commented

2023-11-02 02:07:45 +00:00

exclusively owned means one area owner, right?

I like the compass idea but don't love the idea of tons of one-use compasses... would be nice if a compass could have an option on it like "let holder reprogram this or lock this compass" but that's another matter

the "finish node" that finishes the build is brilliant for automatically including it in the control NPC - and I guess the finish stone or 'touch stone' for prize is one and the same? Very nicely thought out mechanics!

I think players will love this, especially if the prize is XP coins.

exclusively owned means one area owner, right? I like the compass idea but don't love the idea of tons of one-use compasses... would be nice if a compass could have an option on it like "let holder reprogram this or lock this compass" but that's another matter the "finish node" that finishes the build is brilliant for automatically including it in the control NPC - and I guess the finish stone or 'touch stone' for prize is one and the same? Very nicely thought out mechanics! I think players will love this, especially if the prize is XP coins.

DragonWrangler commented

2023-11-02 02:37:21 +00:00

Alias: I think this idea is very good, but maybe instead of them giving a written compass they give you a compass and the coords to write into it, so it could be reusable.

sixer commented

2023-11-02 12:42:42 +00:00

Good idea. Will there be some extra reward for streaks, i.e. doing this quest succesfully X days in a row?

The selection will be totally random, or somehow biased based on distance, being selected in past, etc...?

Good idea. Will there be some extra reward for streaks, i.e. doing this quest succesfully X days in a row? The selection will be totally random, or somehow biased based on distance, being selected in past, etc...?

sixer commented

2023-11-02 20:18:34 +00:00

exclusively owned private area

So if area is shared with your alt account, it is disqualified?

Are there any limits on number of such structures per player? I.e. if I have three distinct interesting areas elsewhere, can I build 3 structures?

Are there some rough guidelines what is acceptable as target? Some interesting building, nature landmark (like highest mountain?)? There is a risk that this will degenerate into "go visit my shop(s)" without some guidelines..

I assume that the area must be accessible by public, but is it acceptable if access is tricky? I.e. the structure is in middle of a maze in the area, on top of mountain that is difficult (but possible) to climb, or somewhere underground (but accessible without digging)?

Would the area owner be able to provide some target description or additional instructions? (i.e. "climb the final mountain from southern side, it is easier" or "not reachable without crystal boots")

> exclusively owned private area So if area is shared with your alt account, it is disqualified? Are there any limits on number of such structures per player? I.e. if I have three distinct interesting areas elsewhere, can I build 3 structures? Are there some rough guidelines what is acceptable as target? Some interesting building, nature landmark (like highest mountain?)? There is a risk that this will degenerate into "go visit my shop(s)" without some guidelines.. I assume that the area must be accessible by public, but is it acceptable if access is tricky? I.e. the structure is in middle of a maze in the area, on top of mountain that is difficult (but possible) to climb, or somewhere underground (but accessible without digging)? Would the area owner be able to provide some target description or additional instructions? (i.e. "climb the final mountain from southern side, it is easier" or "not reachable without crystal boots")

tour commented

2023-11-02 21:41:12 +00:00

I really love this idea: There are so many good builders who build good stuff, and most of it is never honoured. This would also be a great way for mayors which are in need for builders. They might find and meet players which are so far not part of a city, but could help existing ones a lot.

Could I suggest the jonez plants as rewards? They are cool decorations and currently unobtainable.

Two opinions which I would like to throw into the discussion:

IMO one quest everyday is a bit too much: There are a lot of builders on YL who build a lot of cool structures. But I guess we are still too slow to set up a new building each day (taking a look at the amount of BotM submissions. And most of them would fail the preconditions).
Walking to some random area can also be very time-consuming. During christmas most players so so, but... the christmas quest is limited in time. I'm honest: I would participate in the first days, but after a while I would find no time for it and leave it out for that day (especially when there is a high chance that I get to a place where I was already. I'm quite sure that I would - sooner or later - forget to do this quest.
And it would create a flood of rewards (meaning there would be no need to complete it since you can get such a reward every day).
Once a day is far too often, I would prefere a reset once per week.
I'm not such a huge fan to make it only for exclusively owned private areas. Most builders sooner or later end up in a city area. If the city has no harbour/airship connection, most players will never reach it.
Other cool builds are made from groups of players.
I would suggest to change the preconditions into a distance to the nearest fasttravel spot instead of the area type. (like 500/1k nodes away to turn it into an actual walk)

I really love this idea: There are so many good builders who build good stuff, and most of it is never honoured. This would also be a great way for mayors which are in need for builders. They might find and meet players which are so far not part of a city, but could help existing ones a lot. Could I suggest the jonez plants as rewards? They are cool decorations and currently unobtainable. Two opinions which I would like to throw into the discussion: 1) IMO one quest everyday is a bit too much: There are a lot of builders on YL who build a lot of cool structures. But I guess we are still too slow to set up a new building each day (*taking a look at the amount of BotM submissions. And most of them would fail the preconditions*). Walking to some random area can also be very time-consuming. During christmas most players so so, but... the christmas quest is limited in time. I'm honest: I would participate in the first days, but after a while I would find no time for it and leave it out for that day (especially when there is a high chance that I get to a place where I was already. I'm quite sure that I would - sooner or later - forget to do this quest. And it would create a flood of rewards (meaning there would be no need to complete it since you can get such a reward every day). Once a day is far too often, I would prefere a reset once per week. 2) I'm not such a huge fan to make it only for exclusively owned private areas. Most builders sooner or later end up in a city area. If the city has no harbour/airship connection, most players will never reach it. Other cool builds are made from groups of players. I would suggest to change the preconditions into a distance to the nearest fasttravel spot instead of the area type. (like 500/1k nodes away to turn it into an actual walk)

AliasAlreadyTaken commented

2023-11-02 21:58:49 +00:00

daydream exclusively owned means one area owner, right?
sixer: So if area is shared with your alt account, it is disqualified?

Yes. As soon as something is not under the exclusive control of someone, we can't make sure the invitation was extended by all the owners. We could try to have a lot of formspecs and bookkeeping to ask everyone, but that devolves soon into very complex stuff.

... finish stone ...

Yes, that's the same for both finalizing the structure and touching it. At the moment of touch and at the moment of selection we will check the validity of the structure again, so that the owner cannot "finalize" it and THEN change it.

... reusable compass ...

Sorry, too complex. I'd rather have a collection of compasses of areas I liked and discard the rest

Good idea. Will there be some extra reward for streaks, i.e. doing this quest succesfully X days in a row?

That was discussed and turned down, due to streaks becoming the norm then and people who cannot join every day might feel left behind. Also, streaks are a dangerous addiction mechanic and we'd like to avoid those.

The selection will be totally random, or somehow biased based on distance, being selected in past, etc...?

The selection process is not done yet. There will be some selection mechanic, but no clue to its nature.

Are there any limits on number of such structures per player? I.e. if I have three distinct interesting areas elsewhere, can I build 3 structures?

we could make it that the selection process only has a list of people and then if someone hands in more than one structure, another dicethrow selects between the structures handed in by that player. This way, no player who hands in a bazillion of structures gets an edge over others and the player can decide which structure he wants to disable and which one he wants to have active. Unfortunately, every system can be gamed, if that's what you're pointing at. If we notice such a manipulation attempt, we'll act accordingly.

Are there some rough guidelines what is acceptable as target? Some interesting building, nature landmark (like highest mountain?)? There is a risk that this will degenerate into "go visit my shop(s)" without some guidelines..

We could make it that upon touching the finalization block, one can choose whether he liked the hike or not and display that somehow. That's above the grade of complexity I want this to be, but it might help

I assume that the area must be accessible by public, but is it acceptable if access is tricky? I.e. the structure is in middle of a maze in the area, on top of mountain that is difficult (but possible) to climb, or somewhere underground (but accessible without digging)?

Accessible without digging, crystal boots or similar. On top of a mountain: No problem, if people can climb that mountain. In a maze: small maze yes, giant 3d complex maze no. People might be unhappy if they took the hike and then can't reach the goal. A bit tricky: Sure, but no rodeo, necessary glitch-using or parkour.

Would the area owner be able to provide some target description or additional instructions? (i.e. "climb the final mountain from southern side, it is easier" or "not reachable without crystal boots")

This might lead to elaborate and complex descriptions, without those the goal cannot be reached. It also requires understanding the language. Everyone can follow an arrow, but no riddles. Also, no description prevents advertising.

> daydream exclusively owned means one area owner, right? > sixer: So if area is shared with your alt account, it is disqualified? Yes. As soon as something is not under the exclusive control of someone, we can't make sure the invitation was extended by all the owners. We could try to have a lot of formspecs and bookkeeping to ask everyone, but that devolves soon into very complex stuff. > ... finish stone ... Yes, that's the same for both finalizing the structure and touching it. At the moment of touch and at the moment of selection we will check the validity of the structure again, so that the owner cannot "finalize" it and THEN change it. > ... reusable compass ... Sorry, too complex. I'd rather have a collection of compasses of areas I liked and discard the rest > Good idea. Will there be some extra reward for streaks, i.e. doing this quest succesfully X days in a row? That was discussed and turned down, due to streaks becoming the norm then and people who cannot join every day might feel left behind. Also, streaks are a dangerous addiction mechanic and we'd like to avoid those. > The selection will be totally random, or somehow biased based on distance, being selected in past, etc...? The selection process is not done yet. There will be some selection mechanic, but no clue to its nature. > Are there any limits on number of such structures per player? I.e. if I have three distinct interesting areas elsewhere, can I build 3 structures? we could make it that the selection process only has a list of people and then if someone hands in more than one structure, another dicethrow selects between the structures handed in by that player. This way, no player who hands in a bazillion of structures gets an edge over others and the player can decide which structure he wants to disable and which one he wants to have active. Unfortunately, every system can be gamed, if that's what you're pointing at. If we notice such a manipulation attempt, we'll act accordingly. > Are there some rough guidelines what is acceptable as target? Some interesting building, nature landmark (like highest mountain?)? There is a risk that this will degenerate into "go visit my shop(s)" without some guidelines.. We could make it that upon touching the finalization block, one can choose whether he liked the hike or not and display that somehow. That's above the grade of complexity I want this to be, but it might help > I assume that the area must be accessible by public, but is it acceptable if access is tricky? I.e. the structure is in middle of a maze in the area, on top of mountain that is difficult (but possible) to climb, or somewhere underground (but accessible without digging)? Accessible without digging, crystal boots or similar. On top of a mountain: No problem, if people can climb that mountain. In a maze: small maze yes, giant 3d complex maze no. People might be unhappy if they took the hike and then can't reach the goal. A bit tricky: Sure, but no rodeo, necessary glitch-using or parkour. > Would the area owner be able to provide some target description or additional instructions? (i.e. "climb the final mountain from southern side, it is easier" or "not reachable without crystal boots") This might lead to elaborate and complex descriptions, without those the goal cannot be reached. It also requires understanding the language. Everyone can follow an arrow, but no riddles. Also, no description prevents advertising.

Boot commented

2023-11-02 21:59:32 +00:00

If I understand correctly, it's not about a new Building of the Day Event and it's not about honoring good builders. Small prizes are to be paid to the hikers for the effort they make to reach the respective place only. Why shouldn't this place change daily? Of course, every day, because then every player can decide every day whether he wants to set off.

Let's just get started. I see some players chasing pumpkin heads all the time and some never. And so it will be here. But if there happens to be a really special prize among all the small rewards, then word will get around.

If I understand correctly, it's not about a new Building of the Day Event and it's not about honoring good builders. Small prizes are to be paid to the hikers for the effort they make to reach the respective place only. Why shouldn't this place change daily? Of course, every day, because then every player can decide every day whether he wants to set off. Let's just get started. I see some players chasing pumpkin heads all the time and some never. And so it will be here. But if there happens to be a really special prize among all the small rewards, then word will get around.

sixer commented

2023-11-02 23:07:00 +00:00

Accessible without digging, crystal boots or similar. On top of a mountain: No problem, if people can climb that mountain.

The one I had in mind is fairly difficult to climb even with crystal boots. Ok, that one won't fit.

I would suggest to change the preconditions into a distance to the nearest fasttravel spot instead of the area type. (like 500/1k nodes away to turn it into an actual walk)

So being built 19.8 km from nearest fast travel point would disqualify the building too?
500 or even 1k might be tricky with the 150 distance rule.

This might lead to elaborate and complex descriptions, without those the goal cannot be reached. It also requires understanding the language. Everyone can follow an arrow, but no riddles. Also, no description prevents advertising.

It might be useful if the auto-generated description (which I guess would include name of the build owner and coordinates) would contain also name of nearest fast-travel point (air/ship/catapult) ... and perhaps the calculated distance (straight-line) from it, so people can easily decide in advance if they want to participate in the (possibly long) walk, or not. Or, if we do not want to allow description, perhaps be able to select a category (building, nature wonder, ..., other) - maybe by slight alteration of the marker structure's shape?

> Accessible without digging, crystal boots or similar. On top of a mountain: No problem, if people can climb that mountain. The one I had in mind is fairly difficult to climb even with crystal boots. Ok, that one won't fit. > I would suggest to change the preconditions into a distance to the nearest fasttravel spot instead of the area type. (like 500/1k nodes away to turn it into an actual walk) So being built 19.8 km from nearest fast travel point would disqualify the building too? 500 or even 1k might be tricky with the 150 distance rule. > This might lead to elaborate and complex descriptions, without those the goal cannot be reached. It also requires understanding the language. Everyone can follow an arrow, but no riddles. Also, no description prevents advertising. It might be useful if the auto-generated description (which I guess would include name of the build owner and coordinates) would contain also name of nearest fast-travel point (air/ship/catapult) ... and perhaps the calculated distance (straight-line) from it, so people can easily decide in advance if they want to participate in the (possibly long) walk, or not. Or, if we do not want to allow description, perhaps be able to select a category (building, nature wonder, ..., other) - maybe by slight alteration of the marker structure's shape?

JeCel commented

2023-11-02 23:48:39 +00:00

If I understand correctly, it's not about a new Building of the Day Event and it's not about honoring good builders. Small prizes are to be paid to the hikers for the effort they make to reach the respective place only. Why shouldn't this place change daily? Of course, every day, because then every player can decide every day whether he wants to set off.

Let's just get started. I see some players chasing pumpkin heads all the time and some never. And so it will be here. But if there happens to be a really special prize among all the small rewards, then word will get around.

I think it's more about giving everyone a chance to see everything which is pretty low if there are daily changes.

> If I understand correctly, it's not about a new Building of the Day Event and it's not about honoring good builders. Small prizes are to be paid to the hikers for the effort they make to reach the respective place only. Why shouldn't this place change daily? Of course, every day, because then every player can decide every day whether he wants to set off. > > Let's just get started. I see some players chasing pumpkin heads all the time and some never. And so it will be here. But if there happens to be a really special prize among all the small rewards, then word will get around. I think it's more about giving everyone a chance to see everything which is pretty low if there are daily changes.

sixer commented

2023-11-03 09:56:45 +00:00

I guess the daily/weekly may also depend on number of participants. If there would be hundreds, we should go for daily (otherwise a place would wait years to get into rotation). If there would be just dozen, weekly reset would be more appropriate.
That can be set/changed later based on number of participating places.

Also, if cutoff is midnight, how would that work for people that play around midnight? If you pick up the quest destination 30 minutes before midnight and arrive at destination 5 minutes after midnight, would you earn the reward for completing the quest, or not?

It could be useful if the old quest would be completable also some short time (1-4 hours?) after midnight (assuming you have started it and picked the destination before the midnight reset)

I guess the daily/weekly may also depend on number of participants. If there would be hundreds, we should go for daily (otherwise a place would wait years to get into rotation). If there would be just dozen, weekly reset would be more appropriate. That can be set/changed later based on number of participating places. Also, if cutoff is midnight, how would that work for people that play around midnight? If you pick up the quest destination 30 minutes before midnight and arrive at destination 5 minutes after midnight, would you earn the reward for completing the quest, or not? It could be useful if the old quest would be completable also some short time (1-4 hours?) after midnight (assuming you have started it and picked the destination before the midnight reset)

AliasAlreadyTaken added the

2. prio/good first issue

label 2024-02-28 22:46:58 +00:00

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